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'04 Aveo Engine Issues
Hope you guys can help, as I'm getting desperate with this car...
Anyhow, basically what happened to my little automatic 04 Aveo 5 was that my timing belt broke 3 days before the appointment to change came (just my luck).
The car is slightly out of warranty so dealership work is out of the question (yes I know I waited too long to change the belt)
I took it to a local mechanic who told me he could get me a replacement engine (2006 - 15,000km) for $1900 to which I agreed to.
He replaced the engine, and 2 days after I picked up the car (and paid him) the check engine light came on, as I drove it back to his shop the check engine light began to flash and I noticed it wouldn't shift into 4th gear.
He kept this car for a month trying to figure our what's wrong, claiming he has no clue what the codes mean.
(P1781, P0300, P0700, P2610)
I got pissed and took it to a dealership myself since he was getting nowhere.
Dealership came back to me and said that the sparkplugs & wires were no good (he installed my old ones!!)
and that in order to do a proper compression test I need a tune up.
So I shelled out the $300 for the tune up, and $100 for the diagnostic.
Now codes P0300 and P1781 came up (random misfire & Engine Torque circuit/Transmission Control Module)
Dealership quoted TSB #05-06-01-030D and said I need new valves, seals, new cylinder head gasket kit.
That's another $2000 dollars in work!
My local mechanic insists it's a transmission problem
The dealership insists it's an engine problem
And I'm ready to kill them both.
HELP!
Has anyone else had to deal with this?
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
get a third opinion?
take car to dealership, disconnect battery and walk around lot. half hour later come back to car with dealer and say, "shes been good to me but id like to upgrade." trade for cobalt. end problem.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Buy a cobalt supercharged engine. Transplant engine into Aveo. Wow.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
a compression test and a tune up do not have to happen at the same time..
they are trying to double dip you, you pay for the compression test, they have to take of the wires and spark plugs to do the test.. you pay for the tune up, then they just have to put new parts on instead of your old ones, and you pay a second time for them to remove and replace the wires and plugs.. which they only did once.
also take the car back to the original mechanic with the estimate from the dealer, the engine he bought should have some sort of warranty, based on his install abilities. so he should be able to exchange the engine for another.. without cost to you. However it depnds on the type of agreement he has with the receipt of the engine. MOST reputable engine resellers do offer at least 30 day, some offer a year.
Mechanic garages have insurance for this kind of thing. you could call a lawyer and have his insurance pay for the dealer to fix his install mistakes..
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Mike: Not sure where you're at, but here a dealer checks out a trade in thoroughly, this includes a test-drive.
xiaogary: Yeah, I appreciate your sarcasm
Anyways, does anyone know the location of the TCM & ECM on this car?
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
DTC code P0300 this is multi misfire error, there are a lot of reasons why one might get this DTC. Your reason is most likely due to the engine replacement below are some of the reason you might get this DTC my reason is obvious (engine replacement)
Reasons for DTC P0300
1) An engine replacement
2) An ECM replacement
3) A harmonic balancer replacement
4) A crankshaft replacement
5) A CKP sensor replacement
Unfortunately the only way to clear this up is to run the CKP System Variation Learn Procedure which requires a bidirectional scan tool or a trip to the dealer.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Sorry, I didnt meant to be sarcastic. Apologise if I sound like. Really sorry.
Anyway, I sometimes have P0300 also due to my high compression rebuilt engine. But I have a Scangauge. So I can delete it within 5 seconds as I drive with one hand. Press scan, delete code, then return to normal gauges reading.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
it sounds like thehotrodguy is correct,, your car needs to be "relearned"
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by petrified.rabbit
it sounds like thehotrodguy is correct,, your car needs to be "relearned"
how or what is the procedure for an ecm to relearn its working enviroment?
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
its not generally something you can do at home unless you have a good scan tool. even a lot of the mom and pop shops cant do it
THIS IS NOT FOR THE AVEO!! JUST AN EXAMPLE OF HOW THE RELEARN THE ECU (its complicated)
CRANKSHAFT VARIATION RELEARN (CASE Learn)
”CASE” means: crankshaft angle sensor error. A crankshaft variation relearn must be performed if:
A diagnostic trouble code of P1336 is present.
The computer has been replaced or re-programmed.
The crankshaft position sensor has been replaced.
The engine, harmonic balancer, clutch, or flywheel have been: disassembled, removed, or replaced.
The crankshaft position variation learning feature enables the computer to compensate for part manufacturing tolerances. This allows the computer to accurately detect an engine misfire throughout the engine RPM range. The learning process is stored in the computer’s memory and does not have to be repeated unless one or more of the above conditions are present.
THIS IS NOT FOR THE AVEO!! JUST AN EXAMPLE OF HOW THE RELEARN THE ECU (its complicated)
To perform the relearn, proceed as follows:
Connect a scan tool to make sure there are no trouble codes stored in the computer’s memory. If there is any power train trouble code other than P1336 (Crankshaft Position Variation not learned), the computer will disable the relearn function until the problem that aused the code has been eliminated. Also, make sure that the engine coolant (check it when the engine is cold) and oil levels are at an acceptable level.
1. Set the parking brake and block the drive wheels. Make sure that the hood is closed.
2. Start the engine and make sure that the engine coolant temperature is at least 158 degrees F. (70 degrees C.)
3. Turn the engine off for at least 10 seconds.
4. Select the crankshaft position variation learn procedure (CASE Learn)on your scan tool.
5. Make sure that the transmission is in Park. Start the engine.
6. Apply the brakes and hold the pedal firmly.
7. Follow the scan tool instructions.
THIS IS NOT FOR THE AVEO!! JUST AN EXAMPLE OF HOW THE RELEARN THE ECU (its complicated)
Remember: That you are going to increase the engine speed to approximately 3000 RPM, 4000 RPM, or 5150 RPM. That’s the variation learn fuel cutoff RPM (depending upon the engine), and that it’s important to release the throttle when the engine RPM starts to decrease as a result of the fuel cutoff going into effect. Failure to do such will result in over revving of the engine, causing possible engine damage.
8. Once the engine has returned to idle, check the status of Diagnostic trouble code P1336. If the scan tool indicates that the CASE has been learned, the relearn procedure is now complete. If CASE has not been learned, check for the presence of other power train codes. If any exist, correct the problem, then repeat this procedure.
NOTE: If the Crankshaft Variation Relearn is not accessible through your scan tool (some truck applications 1998 & later), perform the relearn in the following manner:
THIS IS NOT FOR THE AVEO!! JUST AN EXAMPLE OF HOW THE RELEARN THE ECU (its complicated)
1. Turn off all of the accessories. With the Air temperature sensor and Coolant temperature within 5 degrees (Centigrade) of each other, start the engine and let it idle in Park or Neutral for two minutes.
2. Accelerate the vehicle to 55 mph at part throttle. Cruise at 55 mph for 8- 10 minutes until the engine reaches operating temperature.
3. Cruise at 55 mph for another 5-6 minutes.
4. Decelerate to 45 mph without using the brakes, and maintain 45 mph for 1 minute.
5. Perform 4 deceleration cycles, without using the brakes, of 25 seconds each where no specific speed is necessary. Returning to 45 mph for 15 seconds in between deceleration cycles.
6. Accelerate to 55 mph and cruise for 2 minutes.
7. Stop the vehicle and idle for 2 minutes with the brake applied and the transmission in Drive (automatic trans.) or Neutral (manual trans.) with the clutch depressed. Refer to diagram A on page 8.
THIS IS NOT FOR THE AVEO!! JUST AN EXAMPLE OF HOW THE RELEARN THE ECU (its complicated)
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
wow! thats seems so complicated. i wonder how when cars are built that the ecu's are programmed for a car that just came from being nothing but parts on a warehouse shelf to the completed vehicle being loaded for delivery.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
stuff like that is really an "american" car thing.. most cars nowadays you clear the codes and everything goes back to normal...
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
I've had the memory "flashed" and after driving for 5 minutes the light comes on again with codes P1781, P0300 & P0700
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
new ecu?
doesnt a flashing CEL mean that the ecu is crap?
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikedudley17
doesnt a flashing CEL mean that the ecu is crap?
A flashing CEL indicates a misfire. The flashing is supposed to get you to stop driving I guess.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by 07_aveo
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikedudley17
doesnt a flashing CEL mean that the ecu is crap?
A flashing CEL indicates a misfire. The flashing is supposed to get you to stop driving I guess.
U sure about that? Gah I wish i could remember where i read that a flashing CEL means there is something wrong with the ECU...
U could be right and prolly are but I coulda swore I read that somewhere. :|
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikedudley17
Quote:
Originally Posted by 07_aveo
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikedudley17
doesnt a flashing CEL mean that the ecu is crap?
A flashing CEL indicates a misfire. The flashing is supposed to get you to stop driving I guess.
U sure about that? Gah I wish i could remember where i read that a flashing CEL means there is something wrong with the ECU...
U could be right and prolly are but I coulda swore I read that somewhere. :|
Both right...
http://www.roberthancock.com/efi/
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
I had a flashing ecu once. The idling is very rough (running only on 3 cylinders) and engine died everytime I stop. Struggled to a nearby car parking area (abt 2 km away) to check my car. Supposed to stop immediately when CEL flashes, but no choice, have to get my car away from the heavy traffic so as not to cause any road hazard. So I didnt really stop when it flashes, just hope my engine dont blast along the way I force it to the car park.
Ended up is a fuel injector clip (electric) never locked in place properly (my mechanic never lock properly, so it jumped out after some vibration), so there is misfires. After put back in place, delete the code with a scangauge, its perfectly ok again. Check your spark plug, injector, and electric cables (sparks) first before investing in a new ecu.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Light is always flashing, and if I drive less than 80kph it's fine, but it won't shift up to 4th gear.
I now have 2 mechanics completely confounded by the thing.
And the kicker is, they both say compression is just fine, only the stealership claims my compression is off, I'm starting to distrust GM.
I hope I can get this thing fixed soon so I can trade the damn thing in! :evil:
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
hi
Your mechanics are vary bad if they cant diagnose you car.
This is the list of your codes.
P700- Transmission fault code exists.
P1781- Power problem with trans.
p2610- Lack of power to engine ECU
P0300- random engine misfire.
Ignore the P300 code for now since the other codes all relate to a transmission electrical issue.
If the cel light was not on before the engine replacement then return to the repair shop and have them check the transmission wiring and engine ground wires.
Code p300 it is random misfire. You need to talk to your mechanic. If the new engine comes as a short block(naked engine just head, block and oil pen) or long block (with everything). (it is very important cuz your misfire can be cause by some thing else)
If you have the obd scanner you can try relearn procedure for crankshaft sensor
1. After night when engine is cold. Turn off all of the accessories. erase all codes
2. Start the engine and let it idle in Park or Neutral for two minutes.
3. Accelerate the vehicle to 55 mph at part throttle. Cruise at 55 mph for 8- 10 minutes until the engine reaches operating temperature.
4. Cruise at 55 mph for another 5-6 minutes.
5. Decelerate to 45 mph without using the brakes, and maintain 45 mph for 1 minute.
6. Perform 4 deceleration cycles, without using the brakes, of 25 seconds each where no specific speed is necessary. Returning to 45 mph for 15 seconds in between deceleration cycles.
7. Accelerate to 55 mph and cruise for 2 minutes.
8. Stop the vehicle and idle for 2 minutes with the brake applied and the transmission in Drive (automatic trans.) or Neutral (manual trans.) with the clutch depressed.
Good luck
Lucas
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Thanks Lucas, the car is with a new mechanic now, I'll tell him to give it a try.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Tried your suggestion Lucas, unfortunately it didn't work.
Light starts flashing as soon as I hit 4th-gear speed, and it won't shift higher than 3rd. POS :evil:
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
it sounds to me that your coils went...prob just two because your up to 3rd gear...that'll cause a blinking cel
check into it seriously
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
what codes you are geting. Is it just P300 or something else. You have to tell me few thing
1. If the new engine comes as a short block(naked engine just head, block and oil pen) or long block (with everything). (it is very important cuz your misfire can be cause by some thing else like lose injectors, leaking air intake)
2. How is your engine idle. Any misfire, engine shaking or something diff
3. Can you try to clean injectors using sea foam or marvel mystery oil. You never know the history of the engine
good luck
Lucas
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Lucas: I get P0300 & P1781
Had a mechanic put in an '06 engine with 25,000 kms but with the '04 intake and throttle (due to the difference in drive-by-wire), changed the plugs, had a computer re-learn, tried replacing the ECM, took it to 2 OTHER mechanics, both are stumped as to why this is still happening.
Car sounds perfect while idling & driving, only issue is the no-shift to 4th (and obviously the light)
Stealership claims the compression is off, but both of the other 2 mechanics say that's BS and that the compression is just fine, so that particular Chevy dealer is blacklisted as far as I'm concerned.
Regardless, I've given up on this car. The light doesn't come on until you try to hit 4th gear speeds so I'm going to reset the sensor, drive to a dealer at low speeds and attempt to trade it in.
Never wasting my money on an Aveo again... wasted $2000 on that engine for nothing. :evil:
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
you should have swapped the LSJ in it!! haha
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
sounds like the overdrive circuit in the tranny is bad. not the engine.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Hi there.
Try to hang in there with me. I know is hard. There are a few conditions for setting P1781 and P300.
I asked you about misfire at idle, you said engine sound good. Check the idle while under a load. Shift in to drive while pressing the brake, press gas pedal very slowly (dont pass the 1/2 throttle) You should be able to fill misfire. The misfire is causing DTC P300
Causes of P300 leaking air intake (cracked or seal) seals of injectors, leaking head gasket (antifreeze), loose injectors connectors (plugs).
Now About DTC P1781.
It is in fact a TCM (Transmission Control Module) fault, but there are conditions that will set the code, as in an interuption in engine speed (depending on the duration and severity of the misfire).
Dealer is telling you the compression is off. He is right in someway. He is using the information from TSB (technical service bulletin) how to fix DTC P1781 and DTC P300.
Hire is the example
* TSB #050601030 -- 1.6L L91 INTERMITTENT MISFIRE COLD DURING DECELERATION OR STEADY STATE HIGHWAY DRIVING AFTER COLD START WITH DTC'S P0300, P0700, P1781 AND/OR U0401 SET (REPLACE VALVES AND VALVE STEM SEALS) *TT UPDATED 11/02/07 *NJ (NHTSA ID #10017820, SEPTEMBER 01 2007)
* TSB #050604003 -- INTERMITTENT ENGINE MISFIRE HESITATION DURING VEHICLE WARM UP. *EH (NHTSA ID #10013476, JANUARY 01 2005)
* TSB #3064 -- SERVICE ENGINE SOON LIGHT ENGINE MISFIRE AND P1781 DIAGNOSTIC TROUBLE CODE. *EH (NHTSA ID #10011589, no date provided)
# TSB #3064 -- SERVICE ENGINE SOON LIGHT AND ROUGH RUNNING WITH DIAGNOSTIC TROUBLE CODES P0700, P1781 AND POSSIBLY A P0300. *TT (NHTSA ID #10009596, JANUARY 01 2004)
# TSB #01575 -- DIAGNOSTIC TROUBLE CODE (DTC) P1781 DIAGNOSTIC IS NOT IN SI YET. POOR FUEL ECONOMY AND/OR HARSH TRANSMISSION SHIFTS. SIT BULLETIN 1413084. *MN (NHTSA ID #10005436, JANUARY 01 2004)
# TSB #3166A -- SERVICE ENGINE SOON LIGHT DUE TO A P0106, P0300 AND/OR P2279. TO INCLUDE THE NEW 2005 PONTIAC WAVE. *TT (NHTSA ID #10010839, no date provided)
In my opinion ( I always can be wrong 8) )the problem is leaking air intake:
- It could be air intake seal. You said the mechanic switch the air intakes. Did he replace the air intake seal?
- he could cracked the air intake when tight the bolts
- he could could moved(turn) the injectors this will cause the injectors seal to leak
What to do
Check your spark plugs for different color. If they look this same is not the head gasket.
check the injectors plugs for loose. Buy the electric connector cleaner spray plug and injector.
Buy a can of brake cleaner or carburetor cleaner. spray it around air intake when the engine is idling and listen the engine reactions. Then tell someone do "idle while under a load" meanwhile you should spray the brake cleaner or carburetor cleaner around air intake and listen the engine reactions. if there is a difference you found the leak.
good luck
Lucas
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
I was initially told it was a tranny problem too. The 1781 code is a general code that came out as a recent announcement from Chevy. I also received the same P0700 and P0300 codes as you. It's a major engine issue. The dealer had to r&r the cylinder head and replaced all the valves, seals & gaskets. Sorry about the bad news. I'd replace the timing belt every 50k miles on the aveo.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
I have an 05 Aveo with the 1.6 engine that had the check engine p300 acceleration/stall problems starting at about 55000 miles. Finally after replacing the plugs, plug wires twice, the catalytic converter(both done at Wallace Chevrolet in Albany Ga) and the coil(done at the Chevrolet dealership in Savannah Ga two months later) the car ran great for the next 25000 miles. Now the same thing is happening again. I suspect the root cause may be the valve seat problem. As I understand it, when the valves dont seat either (1). oil passes into the piston chamber causing plug fouling and misfire letting raw fuel pass out to the catalytic converter or (2) raw fuel passes out the unseaeted exhaust valve directly to the catalytic converter. Either way the raw fuel damages the converter, which to my understanding is already suspect. Seems there is an issue with the converter not getting hot enough to burn off the elements it is designed to causing the washboard to become clogged, it then chokes the engine thus causing your low idle stalls and acceleration problems which seem to get better after it heats up. Anyone have a recomendation on what to say to the dealership to convince them to do the valve job under warranty? Car now has 82000 miles on it, I have an extended 100,000 mile warranty. Also does anyone know if the Fed warranty of 80000 miles for a catalytic converter only applies to the miles on the car total or the miles on the individual part?
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
if i were you, and in a state that does not rape you when it comes to cars, i would but xaiogory's headers and straight pipe it 2" out to the muffler
or for the cheap, you might as well gut the cats too
too bad your running into this problem
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
if you do a cylinder leak down test on the cylinders it will tell you if the valves are seating properly but if there is any compression losses, including rings or head gasket etc, the test will point them in that direction as well.
valve seats are not a common problem however. the symptoms you have lead you to the gas getting into the exhaust, that you hinted to. however, it could be from a running rich condition which can occur from a misfire (p300? this i dont know) but that could be from more likely things like stuck injector, faulty fuel regulator, or bad airflow meter.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by petrified.rabbit
if you do a cylinder leak down test on the cylinders it will tell you if the valves are seating properly but if there is any compression losses, including rings or head gasket etc, the test will point them in that direction as well.
valve seats are not a common problem however. the symptoms you have lead you to the gas getting into the exhaust, that you hinted to. however, it could be from a running rich condition which can occur from a misfire (p300? this i dont know) but that could be from more likely things like stuck injector, faulty fuel regulator, or bad airflow meter.
Actually, there is a TSB about the valve seats for the early Aveo's (04-mid 06). I'd get that checked.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
really? i don't recall that, must of been before my time when it came up last.
well the cylinder leak down with tell you where the problem is at any rate. works kind of like a compression tester but you leave each cylinder at tdc, and apply air pressure through the tool.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by petrified.rabbit
really? i don't recall that, must of been before my time when it came up last.
well the cylinder leak down with tell you where the problem is at any rate. works kind of like a compression tester but you leave each cylinder at tdc, and apply air pressure through the tool.
Well I checked the TSB.... It's been revised to include all engines till 2009... It's due to fuel contamination and calls for a complete clean up of the intake, valve stems and a fuel injector treatment.
The diagnosing symptom is a no start or hard start when temperature is cold and 0psi compression.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
so its not the actual valve seats, its carbon build up between the valve and the seat. I would think that shows the need for a catch can.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Catch can... how hard are those to install? I only know what they do in theory, but don't know if it's a good idea to have one or if it's only when you have a problem... :|
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
its kind of like the idea of adding an inline fuel filter.. just mounting it is a little more difficult as you dont want to overly change the original route to the point the system wont work.
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues
Does anyone have it done to their aveo? :shock:
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Re: '04 Aveo Engine Issues