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I'm trying to get to the air filter, but the air filter box won't open. All the screws were rusted pretty tight: some WD-40 and some elbow grease took care of most of them but there's one persistent little guy that won't go away. The screw is probably damaged, because while it will turn, it won't come up. I tried pressing up against the bottom end that protrudes out of the edge with a second screwdriver, but no luck. Any tips?
based on all your other issues, put on a CAI.
to fix this you will probably need to drill out the screw honestly.
Drilling it out would be a last resort.Quote:
Originally Posted by petrified.rabbit
You didn't say what year your Aveo is. On mine (2009) the box is plastic and the screws have a Philips head. The problem with drilling out the screw is that if it is stripped, it may turn itself while you are drilling it. Also, it's a metal screw into plastic - I don't recall whether the box has a threaded metal insert or whether it is threaded directly into the plastic of the box itself.
Try this: Using a small set of Vise-grip pliers, lock onto the screw head. Pull upward on the screw, exerting pressure as you turn it.
My '04's was a total mess. I actually had to unbolt the air filter box and disconnect at the throttle body. Put it on the work bench and had to carefully drillout 2 or 3 of them. Just to find the filter had not been changed in a very long time.
Mine is an '04. Plastic box, philips head screws. I don't recall seeing a metal thread when I took the other screws out, so I think the plastic is threaded, but I'm not sure. I'll try the vice grip, but I fear there's still enough thread on the screw to prevent it from being pulled out directly, yet not enough to make it come out when you turn it. As a last resort, I wonder if cutting off the head and then trying to turn the protruding end clockwise would make it come out of the bottom.
I'm guessing I'm going to look at a very dirty filter too, once I finally get it open. I doubt anyone has gotten that thing open to replace a filter for a long time. Debating wether I should just order the filter in advance, just so I can replace it immediately once I do get the box open.
One thing I do know: I'm replacing all the screws in this thing.
when you replace them get a higher grade bolt and put some antiseize on them.. I am not sure if the plastic part matters.. it should not. but it will keep the threads "loose"
If it is threaded into plastic (as I think it is) the metal screw will thread itself out as you turn it. If not, at worst with enough pressure exerted upon it, it will strip the threads out of the plastic. Under force, steel trumps plastic...Quote:
Originally Posted by Bas
That might be the harder route to take.Quote:
As a last resort, I wonder if cutting off the head and then trying to turn the protruding end clockwise would make it come out of the bottom.
Hence "last resort". I'll definitely try the vice grip/brute force method first. ;) If all fails and I irreperably ruin the threading in the plastic, I can also just tie-wrap that thing down tightly.
No, there are other choices. You could use a tap to thread the plastic to a larger thread size and use different machine screws. Or you could use self-tapping sheet metal screws.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bas
i have a funny feeling the factory screws are that really soft tin/aluminum screws, hence why the strip so easily.
But thymeclock is on the money with the repair. You could also try a cleco fastener if you found one that fit.
Asian steel is softer than the American steel of years ago. Welcome to the new world of planned obsolescence, disposable income and disposable (non-permanent) materials.:sad3:Quote:
Originally Posted by petrified.rabbit
Well, in the end I had to use a drill and drill off the head. It was impossible to pull it out. After I removed the lid from the filter box I saw why: the thread isn't actually in the plastic of the filter box, but in a little metal oval-shaped cylinder-type thing. So I couldn't pull the screw out by stripping the threads, because those were metal too. and the screw didn't turn: it was still completely stuck in that little metal cylinder, and when I turned the screw, the cylinder would turn with it. I tried to dig it out with a screwdriver but it's impossible to get it out, so I just left it there. I refastened the other three screws and the lid still seems pretty secure on the filter box.
The filter actually looked surprisingly clean. There was a little sand and a tiny bit of leaf in the box, but hardly any, really. I vacuumed the filter and the box and figured it's still good to go for at least a couple of months.
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If you're sticking with the stock air intake, I'd get a K&N filter when it's time to replace (or even RIGHT NOW!) you won't regret it. I switched mine out when I first got the car, and almost a year later cleaned it just for the heck of it even though it didn't need it yet. I read somewhere they're rated for up to 50k miles between cleanings... Was nowhere near that lol.
That's a threaded metal insert that is press fit into the plastic. It has broken loose due to the screw being seized in it, and it rotates when you put torque on it. You can either leave it that way, or rip it out by locking onto what remains of the headless screw and pulling up on it, or drill it out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bas
Considering that that screw became seized you might want to put some anti-seize compound on the other screws when reassembling the air box.
x infinity.Quote:
Originally Posted by Thymeclock
Ah, yes, as in "the squeaky wheel gets the grease". ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by petrified.rabbit
Thanks for the advice. I'm going to the hardware store today to see if I can find some new screws, but antiseize is definitely happening.
if only the stub were longer, you could put a nut on it. know anyone who could tig weld a stud on :D
"If only" ... Well... "if only my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a bus." :DQuote:
Originally Posted by JusteR
If the stub were longer and he could get a die on it, he could re-thread it and install a nut on it.
Since he can't, and since the remaining stud is headless and is stripped, here's an alternative: use a tinnerman nut onto the stripped stud to secure it. ;)
For those who don't know what a tinnerman nut (AKA a 'speed nut') is, do a Google search. :)
Hi Thymeclock
Let me google that for you VBG
I know right-- sorry; slow day.Quote:
"if only my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a bus."
Hopefully, our ideas gave him something he can work with.
Bas, Let us know what you came up with :)
on a serious note/sidebar: This reminds me of those little brass collars that used to retain the headlights on the '96 LH body Mopars. They'd seize, crack/split, spin, and then you'd have to replace the whole lens mount behind the air dam. Fortunately, lenses and mounts got cheaper with time. I finally got rid of my intrepid 2 years ago. See if you can tap out the insert, and epoxy in a longer bolt so you can put a nut on top. if that epoxy spins, then you can put a box end on the bottom. HTHY
Bear in mind that it will be difficult or impossible to keep the press-fit metal insert from turning when the drill bit contacts it in trying to drill it out. Nor can the metal insert be tapped out if it continues to turn in the plastic housing when any torque is put upon it.Quote:
Originally Posted by JusteR
Unless there is something I may have missed here, my previous description and assessment of the problem stands to reason.
Unfortunately for me, you all are not mind readers. :) Tap meant with a hammer. Having not had the problem myself with my Aveo, perhaps I shouldn't be trying to help. With other makes I've encountered, I end up pulling out the air box and finding the bottom of the insert is hex shaped. Its hole is also hex shaped at the bottom but has rounded out.Quote:
Unless there is something I may have missed here, my previous description and assessment of the problem stands to reason.
By this comment, I gather the insert is captivated in the plastic, and unable to come out the bottom. If there were enough material remaining, one could press or punch out the insert and fashion a washer out of a piece of tin or custom grind a washer, tack it to a nut, and epoxy it in place... but that seems like a lot of work.Quote:
Bear in mind that it will be difficult or impossible to keep the press-fit metal insert from turning when the drill bit contacts it in trying to drill it out. Nor can the metal insert be tapped out if it continues to turn in the plastic housing when any torque is put upon it.
Fixed it... Sorry about the confusion:eek:Quote:
See if you can punch out the insert, and epoxy in a longer bolt so you can put a nut on top. if that epoxy spins, then you can put a box end on the bottom. HTHY
Disaster. I tried to get the bolt out, but the plastic from the box snapped. So the bolt and the insert are out, but the round piece of plastic it was in broke off. I superglued it back (without the metal insert and the bolt) and replaced the lid. It's fine for now, but eventually I'll epoxy in a bolt and secure it with a nut.
buy a cai?
i would see about buying a new one out of a junk yard (used parts dealer). and then "fixing" and modifying that one so this does not happen again. then install that. I can't see a used air cleaner costing more than $20, and then take your time rebuilding it correctly. And have no down time.
+1 on recycled stock air box. I'm not into the "cold-air"-air-filters either. I'm also keeping my K&N comments to myself.
Sorry for the sidebar... just thinking out loud.
I take it the inserts are surrounded by plastic :(
I'm not surprised. That's what I expected might happen, as the threaded insert was close to the rim of the box. But it's not a disaster.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bas
Superglue alone won't work, due to the molecular nature of the bond and the direction of force upon it. Use epoxy or body filler and build it up in layers, over the area you glued. Don't epoxy in the bolt - instead build up the surrounding area of the plastic. Actually, if you do a really good job with the epoxy you might be able to get by with reaming out the hole after it has hardened and installing a new screw and nut through the built up area. But don't over-tighten it. Just make it snug enough to help secure that end of the box. ;)
Yeah, I didn't superglue the plastic and then reinsert the bolt, I just superglued it back together and then put the lid back on without the bolt or the insert. (The other three bolts are still there, of course). So there's no force on it. I just glued it so I wouldn't lose the broken off piece of plastic.
Thanks for the tips on the epoxying. I'll get around to it sometime. First I got a leaky valve cover gasket (I hope) to replace.